More myths busted about electric cars
April 27, 2010 By Jim Motavalli
I recently went to Finland to drive the all-electric Think City plug-in car (thinkev.com), which is already on European roads and coming to the U.S. later this year. To help it have a soft landing, Think CEO Richard Canny (who spent 25 years at Ford) put together these nine myths about electric vehicles (EV). I've had my own version, but Richard's list is quite different and well worth sharing. He's not an objective party, of course, but he has hands-on experience.
Here are Canny's nine electric vehicle myths:
1. You are just moving the pollution out of the cities to the countryside.
Busted: Electric vehicle motors are three-to-five times more efficient than gasoline-powered vehicles. While it's best to power EVs from renewable energy sources (which are growing quickly), the efficiency of EVs makes them cleaner, producing less carbon, under any situation -- even when they are charged using coal-fired electricity.
2. Customers will never buy a car with less than a 200-mile range.
Busted: So-called "range anxiety" diminishes when people get used to driving EVs on a daily basis. It's just like charging a cell phone overnight. You plug it in, and in the morning it's ready to go, fully charged. As more EVs hit the road, businesses and cities will add charging points to encourage EV use. EVs can also be fast-charged (our system goes from zero to 80 percent charged in just 15 minutes) to help cover those rare situations when an EV will be needed to cover more than 100 miles in a single day.
3. The battery won't last.
Busted: EV batteries are designed to last at least 10 years and more than 100,000 miles. There are cars on the road in Europe with batteries approaching the 10-year mark. Some EVs have been on the road in Europe with packs approaching the 10-year-old mark, and modern lithium-ion batteries will definitely meet or exceed that target.
4. You'll need to build a lot more power plants.
Busted: Actually, there's enough off-peak electricity in the U.S. to power 79 percent of U.S. driving demand. As more EVs are deployed, it's important to ensure that the smart-charging (time-based charging management) and vehicle-to-grid connectivity progresses as well. A connected network of millions of micro-energy storage devices (which is what EVs will become) provides significant opportunities to improve the stability and performance of electric grids and better balance peak demand.
5. We're going to run out of lithium - and isn't it poisonous?
Busted: Lithium carbonate today comes from dried salt lakes in South America (Chile, Argentina and Bolivia) and China. There are also other huge sources for lithium, although these are more expensive to develop. Lithium can even be extracted from salt water and projects are under way to do this. The industry will not have a shortage of lithium for the next decade. It is also possible that new battery technologies will be based on other light metals like zinc or nickel. Lithium from used batteries will be recycled in dedicated recycling plants. Lithium batteries contain no poisonous heavy metals like lead in lead-acid batteries or cadmium in NiCd batteries.
6. The infrastructure has to come first.
Busted: The best way to deploy EVs is to get cars on the road first, then add infrastructure. If there are no EVs to use those plugs and parking spots, people see it as wasteful. We think infrastructure is a small part of good policy at a federal, regional and local level to support EV early adopters.
7. They're not safe.
Busted: Highway-certified EVs meet all the same safety and crash test requirements as regular production cars with some important extras.
8. The technology is too complicated.
Busted: A modern electric car has only about five main moving parts compared with hundreds in an internal-combustion engine. There are no regular visits to the dealership for an EV. No oil changes, no filters -- even brake pads last two-to-three times longer than in conventional cars, because EVs use regenerative braking to recapture the energy that would otherwise be lost while braking. Your first trip to the dealership with an EV for scheduled maintenance is at 40,000 miles to check the brake pads. Eventually, you'll need new wiper blades and tires. But that's about it!
9. Fast charging EV batteries in 15 minutes will wear them out quickly.
Busted: Modern prismatic lithium batteries can be developed with fast-charging in mind. The critical technology is in the cell design to manage battery temperature during charging. Limiting fast charging to the zero to 80 percent range also protects battery life. We think that 95 percent or more of all EV miles will be driven on cars charged during overnight off-peak periods when electricity is cheaper and readily available. Fast charging locations provide reassurance and peace of mind for those occasional days where more than 100 miles are required.
More information: Earlier story: Five myths about electric cars - http://www.physorg … 8543729.html
(c) 2010, Mother Nature Network.
Distributed by McClatchy-Tribune Information Services.
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Apr 27, 2010
Rank: 2.8 / 5 (12)
I wish they would bring back Thomas Edison's Nickle Iron battery. But I guess its bad business to make a rechargeable battery that lasts over 30 years. A Chinese company is actually making some but with the shipping and all they are very expensive.
Apr 27, 2010
Rank: 4.9 / 5 (17)
Apr 27, 2010
Rank: 3.8 / 5 (11)
Many folks have a spare 500$ for their entertainment funds.. many are afraid, as you are, to drop a few 10k on an EV that has so many myths and old information surronding it.
I dunno maybe you've got some refutations of the facts presented here... but it seems more like you're just on the Anti-EV Pro-FOX bandwagon.
I feel for your ignorance.
J-n
Apr 27, 2010
Rank: 3.4 / 5 (8)
I notice you didn't address any of the points in the article. You also compared apples to oranges and went on to say myths are true.
Give me one reason not to laugh at your feeble "arguments."
Apr 27, 2010
Rank: 2.6 / 5 (8)
I take from this that EVs are still the more expensive option.
So there you have it. It's that simple. Those other things matter too, but this is the key.
Apr 27, 2010
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Apr 27, 2010
Rank: 4.3 / 5 (4)
Apr 27, 2010
Rank: 3.9 / 5 (7)
Apr 27, 2010
Rank: 4.6 / 5 (5)
Apr 27, 2010
Rank: 2.7 / 5 (7)
I would consider buying an electric car in the future if I was informed about both the positive and negative aspects, but this article is not very informative.
Apr 27, 2010
Rank: 4.3 / 5 (6)
The problem is the limited range. These just won't make it for an 8 hour trip to visit relatives, and there is no good way to make them do it until the infrastructure is VERY advanced, i.e., charging stations almost as ubiquitous as gasoline stations are today.
Apr 27, 2010
Rank: 1.4 / 5 (5)
Apr 27, 2010
Rank: 4 / 5 (4)
Just like any vehicle it has its pros and cons. Smart buyers will weigh their options and make the choice themselves.
Apr 27, 2010
Rank: 5 / 5 (8)
Apr 27, 2010
Rank: 3.5 / 5 (6)
This compares with internal combustion engines that are about 25%.
Basically, it's more or less a wash. OTOH the power station is easier to scrub its exhaust gases, and the power doesn't come from oil, which is running out, it comes from other sources like coal, natural gas, nuclear, geo, wind, solar etc. etc. which is a much more flexible mix and can be *much* greener.
Apr 27, 2010
Rank: 4.5 / 5 (6)
If there was one that looked like a Ferrari I would buy it in a heartbeat!!!!
Apr 27, 2010
Rank: 2.7 / 5 (6)
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 5 / 5 (2)
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 4.6 / 5 (7)
Almost all journeys are very short ones so EV make perfect sense. Also many families have 2 cars so no great loss.
I agree that this article is not balanced but think Jim made that clear at the outset when introducing Canny's "myths".
I believe that EV's are inevitable and there will be huge incentives to make the switch such as tax breaks, free parking, free charging for staff in government (and other) offices etc. In London EV's do not pay the toll either and this is a great start.
Hybrids (IMHO) are a cop out and you end up with the worst of both options but at least this could be seen as a transition from ICE to EV.
Let's see the prices come down quickly but this will only happen if manufacturers start mass production and there is serious competition.
I also agree that most EV car designs look like shit!
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 1.8 / 5 (5)
Charging stations would need to be as numerous as gas stations to make people comfortable with driving far from home.
Would also need some sort of backup option in case your car runs out of power, similar to a spare can of oil you'd keep in your car now. A portable battery that doesn't lose its charge for example, that could be plugged in and drive you for 50km or so.
Until those things are addressed I couldn't see myself making such a switch. Electric cars are a good idea, but they need to work on those three specific things I just mentioned.
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 3.8 / 5 (4)
How often do you do this though? When you do- just hire a conventional car.
Electric vehicles are wayyyy cheaper, so you would still save money.
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 3.2 / 5 (5)
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 2.4 / 5 (8)
Either more range is needed or recharge stations need to start appearing. I've still never seen one.
I visit London often and would expect to see them there at least.
If I want to go on holiday in one of these, I'd be truely stuffed.
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 3.7 / 5 (7)
Over 85% of people in the U.S. drive less then 50 miles a day, get over yourself.
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 1.5 / 5 (8)
The United States does not have the surplus electrical generating capacity to convert even 10% of our vehicles to electric (battery).
Pig in a poke, aka Pixie Dust.
Come back after you have completed those 100 1GW fission plants we need to move into the future.
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 3.6 / 5 (5)
then you bought your first car like what two years ago and had them make the gas tank bigger...
at 35 mpg -- you need 14 gallon tank and most cars that get 35 or more only have a 11 gallon tank.
and the 45 mpg vehicles are hybrids with a 10 gallon tank.
-- The US does have the capacity today for 30% of vehicles to convert to electric power
why? well slow charging takes four hours and is recommended at night... now lets talk about kilowatt hours needed to charge .. EV need less juice than running your air conditioner on a hot summer night give it up Shootist
and id anyone read the part that said
[p] Richard's list is quite different and well worth sharing. He's not an objective party, of course, but he has hands-on experience [/p]
it wasn't meant to be objective it was meant to sell vehicles
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 1 / 5 (2)
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 5 / 5 (3)
Mythbusters would have crappy ratings if it wasn't for people questioning myths.
I'mm one of the 15% that a 200 mile EV won't work for. Unfortunately I'm going to have to wait until they have roadside quickcharge or battery swap in common and remote locations.
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 3.3 / 5 (4)
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 5 / 5 (4)
In the U.S., the average cost of a kWh is 10.4 cents. The Nissan Leaf and Chevy Volt will travel about 4 miles on a kWh. That equates to about 2.5 cents per mile. Also, there is virtually no maintenance required, no time spent going to a gas station, and the cars always work.
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 1 / 5 (3)
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 5 / 5 (1)
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 2.5 / 5 (2)
The Lexus EVs are going to look the same as the regular line when they come out. I'm waiting for one of those. It'll be pricey, but it'll probably be the best option.
Apr 28, 2010
Rank: 4 / 5 (2)
Apr 30, 2010
Rank: 3.3 / 5 (3)
Electric cars can help, like the golf cart. But until they can carry a family to grandma's or uncle Bill's two states away, they will not supplant the gasoline powered hybrids.
But.... life/work in the cities seems insane to me. I hated city life when in college and never went back. If you are a city dweller, THANKS! Stay there and please don't learn what you are missing.... after all, you wouldn't want to pay for the gas to travel out here!
May 01, 2010
Rank: 4 / 5 (1)
I love how you say "Virtually EVERY home in communities", i have yet to see this where i live.
As to the EV idea i consider it a good one for those who do not travel much (if you dont mind the price of the car), but its not really there for those who travel far especially with the lack of charging stations. Also the design.... Why not use some imagination?
May 01, 2010
Rank: 4.7 / 5 (3)
I would like to see full sized vehicles instead of clown cars and a defrost that can heat up a car in 5 mins at -30 C temperatures first.
Plus an air cond that can run full blast all day at +30 C
May 02, 2010
Rank: 3 / 5 (2)
Electric motors operate at far higher torque than conventional engines. EVs are already used to Haul planes, and I'm not talking 747s I'm talking C140s, Boeing Super 7's. etc. EVs have far more towing than even diesels do. Your AC blower runs on electric in all vehicle, the pump itself can be turned by anything, including the output shaft of an EV engine. I'm a gear head, but EVs are the way the world will go. I just wish they could full charge in 5 minutes, making them comparable to gas in the only way they really fall short.
May 02, 2010
Rank: 5 / 5 (2)
May 02, 2010
Rank: 1 / 5 (3)
Rare earth elements... like iron? Aluminum? Copper? Oh yeah... really rare
May 02, 2010
Rank: 5 / 5 (2)
I agree totally.The Volt is the best of both worlds.For the 85% who travel less than 50 miles a day,it means all electric driving.For those who want to take a driving vacation,it also works,albeit with greater use of gasoline.No need for two cars.As battery technology improves,it would need less and less backup from the ICE.
May 02, 2010
Rank: 5 / 5 (2)
No, lanthanides like Cerium, Promethium, Neodynium, about 11kg per EV in all.
May 02, 2010
Rank: not rated yet
May 03, 2010
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Last I heard the Tesla was a pretty sexy sports car with a good range and incredible performance.
May 03, 2010
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May 12, 2010
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